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Old 03-02-2008   #11
Sheriff Ice
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Default Re: Freedom?

well for me its not important to have the right of free speech but how to use that right, is it for good or for evil?!
this is how it differ


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Old 03-03-2008   #12
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Default Re: Freedom?

Quote:
Originally Posted by icemaker View Post
well for me its not important to have the right of free speech but how to use that right, is it for good or for evil?!
this is how it differ
How can freedom of speech be used for evil? Who is to specify what is evil? AND in't labeling someone as an evil person an "evil" act itself ?

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Originally Posted by Adam View Post
But that's what they are, SUBcultures. Democratically, they can't tell the majority how to live.

As for globalization, the rights such "the right to live" and "freedom of speech" are the norm for most of the world. When it comes to extreme regimes such as Iran and the KSA, the lack of human rights is a result of ignorance and greed. The problems in such nations are solved with time, remember that the democratic nations were the same as Iran and the KSA in the past.
Well then very well, in global issues we have human rights that are universal, and guess what, it protects freedom of speech and says nothing about someone's "feelings" being hurt or not.....

Iran and KSA had an extra dosage of religion and you are right when you say they are like europe hundreds of years ago where atheists,jews, and "witches" were burned...

As for subcultures, they should not interfere by force with policies but as you said through the democratic process.....All that said, if a muslim doesn't like the ideals that developed in Europe and thinks that they contradict with islam, and if he really cares about his religion that much, I don't see the point of staying in europe.....

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akid I believe in freedom of speech but i also believe that bashing and attacking others/other's opinions and beliefs in a personal and bad way has nothing to do with the "democratic" freedom of speech. (ya3ne i dnt have the right to vilify and attack a person, group or subject in a harsh n prejudicial way )
The above is for you too Miss Mandy. But I will give an example to clarify things. I, a single man, go to my married friend and see his wife for the first time. Infront of her I tell him,"After I have seen your stupid ugly annoying wife, I decided that I will not get married ever especially when I see how dumb you are not to notice how disgusting she is."

Well, I think the above is a good example of "rude" freedom of speech....Do you really think that I(in this story) should be killed or even jailed for saying that? What if I wanna say it on TV or in a newspaper? Did I hurt him in anyway but tell him how I feel about his marriage or his wife? Even if my comment causes him to leave his wife eventually(Did muslims leave their faith after seeing the bomb on their prophets head?), Am I to be blamed for simply expressing what I feel?

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Old 03-03-2008   #13
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Default Re: Freedom?

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Originally Posted by athegan View Post


The above is for you too Miss Mandy. But I will give an example to clarify things. I, a single man, go to my married friend and see his wife for the first time. Infront of her I tell him,"After I have seen your stupid ugly annoying wife, I decided that I will not get married ever especially when I see how dumb you are not to notice how disgusting she is."

Well, I think the above is a good example of "rude" freedom of speech....Do you really think that I(in this story) should be killed or even jailed for saying that? What if I wanna say it on TV or in a newspaper? Did I hurt him in anyway but tell him how I feel about his marriage or his wife? Even if my comment causes him to leave his wife eventually(Did muslims leave their faith after seeing the bomb on their prophets head?), Am I to be blamed for simply expressing what I feel?

Peace
Actually, you could get jailed(light sentences) for saying that in most countries. You are forget the right not to be insulted, because an insult is an attack. Now, there are diffrent kinds of attacks. For example, if you make joke about the French(about french bread, french language, etc.) then it's just a joke not an attack, but if the joke is hate-driven then it is an attack.

I'm not saying that it's ok to pull out an RPG and blow up half of the neighborhood, but you have the right to be angry if you are insulted.

P.S: Remember that rights are neither fully defined or specified.
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Old 03-03-2008   #14
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Default Re: Freedom?

Freedom of speech is about the content of the speech, and therefore, is directly connected to freedom of thought
It's difficult to take people's freedom of thought. I think all they can do is , stop people to speak their mind in public....


Since thoughts are necessarily free (no one can control them), there is no sense in which the protection of "freedom of thought" is a meaningful phrase
Only the "freedom of speech" (and of course, acts) can be protected or assaulted.


And the freedom of thought could be seriously threatend if people wouldn't have the freedom of speech. You can't say someone has the freedom of thought when he recieves wrong information about most of thing(his country and the world) and he can't challenge the new ideas and even be aware of them

Freedom of speech is certainly available on the internet. Although private owners of websites certainly have a right to edit their site as they see fit.
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Old 03-04-2008   #15
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Default Re: Freedom?

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Originally Posted by Adam View Post
Actually, you could get jailed(light sentences) for saying that in most countries. You are forget the right not to be insulted, because an insult is an attack. Now, there are diffrent kinds of attacks. For example, if you make joke about the French(about french bread, french language, etc.) then it's just a joke not an attack, but if the joke is hate-driven then it is an attack.

I'm not saying that it's ok to pull out an RPG and blow up half of the neighborhood, but you have the right to be angry if you are insulted.

P.S: Remember that rights are neither fully defined or specified.
Again, You answere what the laws are in some countries...We are more concerned here with what is right or wrong, what makes sense and what doesn't.... In the example I gave, any harm can't be beyond "dala3 3al fade"...that doesnt concern me if i was writing a law for a country....If you wanna take current laws as cultural standards and respect each countries "standards" without applying logic to test them, you will be disappointed with many laws in the middle east... Anyway, i think what i said already(and what jess later added) is enough on this subject to explain where i stand on the issue....

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Old 03-06-2008   #16
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Default Re: Freedom?

Freedom of speech exists, and especially in Lebanon. You hear 14 Marchs speeches. Freedom of speech indeed.
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Old 03-06-2008   #17
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Default Re: Freedom?

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How can freedom of speech be used for evil? Who is to specify what is evil? AND in't labeling someone as an evil person an "evil" act itself ?

Man?!?!

HAHAHA, i had to say so,

how can freedom of speech be used for evil?!?!?!

i dont think i do need to answer you,

i just can advise to watch LBC, FTV, and to listen to the politician crap they say everyday.
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Old 03-08-2008   #18
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Default Re: Freedom?

Quote:
Originally Posted by icemaker View Post
Man?!?!

HAHAHA, i had to say so,

how can freedom of speech be used for evil?!?!?!

i dont think i do need to answer you,

i just can advise to watch LBC, FTV, and to listen to the politician crap they say everyday.
You do know that they say the same thing about you, right? and about manar and OTV, right?

Tayyeb what about me ? I like GMA and dislike HA...my speech will be semi-evil ? anyway this is becoming irrelevant...."evil" is clearly subjective so you can't judge by yourself and put a universal rule that someone is "evil" because that varies....

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