كيف تتم صناعة الغباء؟

[bitarno]

مجموعة من العلماء و ضعوا 5 قرود في قفص واحد

و في وسط القفص يوجد سلم و في أعلى السلم هناك بعض الموز

في كل مرة يطلع أحد القرود لأخذ الموز يرش العلماء باقي القرود بالماء البارد بعد فترة بسيطة أصبح كل قرد يطلع لأخذ الموز, يقوم الباقين بمنعه

و ضربه حتى لا يرنشون بالماء البارد

بعد مدة من الوقت لم يجرؤ أي قرد على صعود السلم لأخذ الموز على الرغم من كل الإغراءات خوفا من الضرب

بعدها قرر العلماء أن يقوموا بتبديل أحد القرود الخمسة و يضعوا مكانه قرد جديد

فأول شيء يقوم به القرد الجديد أنه يصعد السلم ليأخذ الموز

ولكن فورا الأربعة الباقين يضربونه و يجبرونه على النزول

بعد عدة مرات من الضرب يفهم القرد الجديد بأن عليه أن لا يصعد السلم مع أنه لا يدري ما السبب

قام العلماء أيضا بتبديل أحد القرود القدامى بقرد جديد

و حل به ما حل بالقرد البديل الأول حتى أن القرد البديل الأول شارك زملائه بالضرب و هو لايدري لماذا يضرب

و هكذا حتى تم تبديل جميع القرود الخمسة الأوائل بقرود جديدة

حتى صار في القفص خمسة قرود لم يرش عليهم ماء بارد أبدا

و مع ذلك يضربون أي قرد تسول له نفسه صعود السلم بدون أن يعرفوا ما السبب

لو فرضنا ..

و سألنا القرود لماذا يضربون القرد الذي يصعد السلم؟

أكيد سيكون الجواب : لا ندري ولكن وجدنا آباءنا وأجدادنا له هكذا

“عادات وتقاليد”

هناك شيئين لا حدود لهما ... العلَم و غباء الإنسان

هكذا قال أينشتاين

“عادااااات وتقاااااليد”

عملياً هذا ما نطبقه نحن في أعمالنا وحياتنا اليومية

نبقى في الروتين خوفاً من التغيير

[xcoder]

I loved it, it's very true.
People prefer the bad known on the unknown.
We have too many monkeys in Lebanon unfortunately.

[Neoxter]

How did they know that the monkey is ignorant of why it's hitting the other monkeys ?

[SysTaMatIcS]

sometimes when you go out of the traditions , or of what is not known , they would call you an outcast or a weirdo , while youre thinking WTF , im talkin logic , these stupid people are really stupid and wont ever get it! so eventually you just go with the flow.

[Adam]

A 1 year old baby starts running towards a well, you stop him and take him away from it.
He does it again, you yell at him, he gets sad but it's better than him dying, right?
If he does it yet again, you'd then yell at him louder, he'd then know that he shouldn't go near the well.
If he sees another baby running towards the well, and he stops him without knowing why, would you see that as intelligent or stupid?

P.S: Funny story

[mr_j]

the analogy is false. When babies grow up to be be men and women they will realise that it is safe to go near the well if they take certain precautions. The monkeys will never try to figure how to get the banana without being sprayed. And similiarly many humans follow certain traditions as they are and never try to figure out a better way of yielding benefit out of stuff without getting hurt
Edit: specific example, thousands of years ago, blood transfusion caused disease and death because it was not done properly, so jews banned blood transfusion. And now, despite it becoming safe and a sure way to save lives, people are still following the tradition of no blood transfusion. Same applies for other things

another thing :P
the baby yelled at the other beby to protect him, that is smart, the monkeys beat the other monkey for a selfish reason. It is closer to saudi arabia sending you to jail and beating the sh*t out of you for drinking alcohol, and claiming to be protecting you.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by mr_j

the analogy is false. When babies grow up to be be men and women they will realise that it is safe to go near the well if they take certain precautions. The monkeys will never try to figure how to get the banana without being sprayed.

The monkeys can only be compared to babies, grown ups have much a higher level of intelligence. The monkeys never figure out how to get the banana because they can't figure it out.
What would happen after a while if one of the monkeys tried to get the banana? The others would get sprayed with cold water. So it would have been stupid to let him try taking the banana?
This is very normal for animals to do. Look at the Animal Channel at any time and you will see an animal that behaves in certain ways only because his parents behave that way, if they didn't, baby zebras would think lions are their best friend.

Originally Posted by mr_j

And similiarly many humans follow certain traditions as they are and never try to figure out a better way of yielding benefit out of stuff without getting hurt
Edit: specific example, thousands of years ago, blood transfusion caused disease and death because it was not done properly, so jews banned blood transfusion. And now, despite it becoming safe and a sure way to save lives, people are still following the tradition of no blood transfusion. Same applies for other things

I never said that traditions can't be stupid but not learning from others who have experience in diffidently moronic.

Originally Posted by mr_j

another thing :P
the baby yelled at the other beby to protect him, that is smart, the monkeys beat the other monkey for a selfish reason.

Actually the baby had no idea why he shouldn't go there, but he knew he shouldn't. Same for the monkeys, they had no idea why they shouldn't go the but they knew that they shouldn't.
Chimps are as intelligent as babies, so they would have probably come to the same conclusion.

Originally Posted by mr_j

It is closer to saudi arabia sending you to jail and beating the sh*t out of you for drinking alcohol, and claiming to be protecting you.

Not that I agree with Saudis much but drinking is a health hazard.
Although I doubt they beat you to protect you...

[mr_j]

I never said that traditions can't be stupid but not learning from others who have experience in diffidently moronic

they didn't learn, that's the point. they just took a stupid road out of a risk... monkeys cannot be compared to babies, babies as I said will grow, monkeys will not improve so they are compared to people who will not improve

Actually the baby had no idea why he shouldn't go there, but he knew he shouldn't. Same for the monkeys, they had no idea why they shouldn't go the but they knew that they shouldn't.
Chimps are as intelligent as babies, so they would have probably come to the same conclusion.

the monkeys did not stop the monkey from climbing because he was going to be sprayed if he did, they stopped him from going up because they were going to be sprayed if he did... in the baby example, if the other baby went and fell into the well, the other baby that did not warn him would not have lost anything, what the baby did was smart and unselfish, unlike the monkeys

Not that I agree with Saudis much but drinking is a health hazard.
Although I doubt they beat you to protect you...

they don't beat you because you drove drunk or because you got wasted, they would beat you if you drank 1 beer during the world cup :P a traditional Lebanese father might beat his daughter to death if he knew she had sex and she is not married. in the old days, with diseases, unwanted pregnancy etc... it was understandable, in our days it is no more than a shallow tradition with little to no reasoning behind it

[Adam]

Like it or not, society will always have rules and you will always follow them.
Name one time in history where people have liked the society they live in? There are none.
Name one time in history where people didn't abide by the rules of society? There are none.

I live in a society where such rules barley exist, and guess what? People don't like.
They complain about whatever social rules that exist and they complain about all the social rules that don't exist.

You're complaining about the rules not having a purpose. Well, they do. Some rules exist simply so that society can work.
You were talking about the relationship between a girl who has sex and her father. (Again. You know, someday you will have to tell us about your story with that girl? )
Let's put the father beating the girl aside for a second. (I don't agree with this practice, but it still exists so I'll come back to it at the end.)
As long as there is no beating, you'd think that she'd bring a guy home and have sex, right? Wrong. Any fatherly figure figure wouldn't like the girl he loves sleeping around, because he'd feel like she's being taken advantage of (She wants it or not, doesn't matter, he's still going to feel that way). The girl, who in a normal situation, loves her father wouldn't want him feeling that way. Now it's her choice to have sex or not to, but if she does, you can be sure that she won't tell her father. Why? Because it's one of those rules that exist so that society would work. It's give and take.

You will always have conservatives and liberals, one trying to make more rules and the other trying to make less. One calling the other anarchist and the other calling him tyrant.
Can you give an example where anarchy or tyranny works?
A middle ground would work best, and even then, people would complain.

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Regarding the father beating girl thing: I don't agree with parents beating their children regularly, but if you have a kid who, from what you can tell, is making a big mistake, the it's OK to give him/her a wake up slap.
Whether sleeping around is a big mistake or not, I can't tell. Each society has it's own rules in regards of right and wrong.

[mr_j]

I agree with most of what you said but we should make a distinction between someone who sticks with tradition because he is convinced by them, and people who follow traditions just for the sake of following tradition. in Lebanon, the government affairs are a tradition, that we just follow out of fear of change