Thieving Death

[Gilgamesh]

Originally Posted by abousoun

Well it's easy when you see something wrong to reply on it ... and since you read many books about zionism (which is something good for you) where did you find the part where it says our zionism hate comes from SHN ?
fa bala hal laf w el dawaran w the usage of "not it's not me ... it's you" ...
and beleive me i can easily know phobias and obsessions ... u still can't tell

and just a comment, that Herzel was the founder of new zionism or modern zionism (something like that) ... after being a social or religious mvt, he made the political mvt ...

Thank You ...

For the part in red, I have no reason to believe you Phobias are unjustified fears; my dislike of HA, their leader, their political stances, their regional behavior, and above all their ideology and religious makeup are perfectly logical if you follow my argument however you don't and you still refuse to answer many points in every argument about them (Here I have to salute Kain for being more courageous and saying that the spade is a spade when it comes to HA ideology)...

For the part in blue, The Jewish State was the first book on what Zionism as we know it is (by Theodor Herzl). He lacked the religious side so never mentioned in his book Palestine as the destination of the Jewish state and in later publications even mentions Argentina. The Old Testamant and Torah fanatics, the money controlling religious orthodox jews, later on, put as a condition to go with Herzl's plan that the land be the Holy Land of the people of Israel which is what was at the time Palestine. Since the fact that it is from the Old Testament, of course it is older than Herzl but not part of what Zionism originally is.

[abousoun]

Originally Posted by athegan

For the part in red, I have no reason to believe you Phobias are unjustified fears; my dislike of HA, their leader, their political stances, their regional behavior, and above all their ideology and religious makeup are perfectly logical if you follow my argument however you don't and you still refuse to answer many points in every argument about them (Here I have to salute Kain for being more courageous and saying that the spade is a spade when it comes to HA ideology) ...

I'm not forcing you to beleive me and you don't have to my friend, and your arguments (which i follow) are perfectly logical according to the way you think, but since i find them unjustified or irrational, intense and persistent then they are categorized under phobias ...
and concerning the refusal to answer many points in every argument ... eno just check this thread and see who is avoiding !!! ...
if your arguments and logic says that we hate zionism just because SHN hate them ... then i'm happy to tell you that i know nothing about logic

Originally Posted by athegan

Since the fact that it is from the Old Testament, of course it is older than Herzl but not part of what Zionism originally is.

you mean "originally is" according to Herzel (alla yghami2lo) the founder of the modern zionism (politically speaking), otherwise you would used "currently is" ...

Originally Posted by athegan

The Jewish State was the first book on what Zionism as we know it is (by Theodor Herzl). He lacked the religious side so never mentioned in his book Palestine as the destination of the Jewish state and in later publications even mentions Argentina.

concerning "The jewish state" book of Herzl, eno it lacked the religious side ... eno okey ma kein taghe 3aleih el religious side but in the same time when you talk about anti-semitism betkoun in a way or another hinting about religion ...
and concerning Palestine, here in this book he mentioned both Palestine and Argentina as favorable lands for the jews, and with the analysis of each country, he was in favor of Palestine !!!

Thank You ...

[Gilgamesh]

Originally Posted by abousoun

I'm not forcing you to beleive me and you don't have to my friend, and your arguments (which i follow) are perfectly logical according to the way you think, but since i find them unjustified or irrational, intense and persistent then they are categorized under phobias ...
and concerning the refusal to answer many points in every argument ... eno just check this thread and see who is avoiding !!! ...
if your arguments and logic says that we hate zionism just because SHN hate them ... then i'm happy to tell you that i know nothing about logic

First of all, I accused Marx 92 of what I accused him (reread his post and how I replied to him) and thats all....I didn't generalize to everyone ALTHO I am still convinced that the majority of ppl who mention the word Zionism have no idea what it means and just repeat it after SHN...you happen to be knowledgeable and educated and in that there is no doubt, but we are talking about the majority not about the elite like urself I am not avoiding any argument between us in this thread because there is no argument It is more like babbling to annoy each other, but what are we really debating ?

Originally Posted by abousoun

you mean "originally is" according to Herzel (alla yghami2lo) the founder of the modern zionism (politically speaking), otherwise you would used "currently is" ...

Yeah...and the rest of the answer goes bellow...

Originally Posted by abousoun

concerning "The jewish state" book of Herzl, eno it lacked the religious side ... eno okey ma kein taghe 3aleih el religious side but in the same time when you talk about anti-semitism betkoun in a way or another hinting about religion ...
and concerning Palestine, here in this book he mentioned both Palestine and Argentina as favorable lands for the jews, and with the analysis of each country, he was in favor of Palestine !!!

Thank You ...

He exactly mentions the reason I mentioned about orthodox jews and their ability to mobilize religious orthodox jews be it as First settlers( poor uneducated jews from Romania and Eastern Europe in general) to the last settlers whose original efforts will be through funding (Mainly French Jews at the time according to Herzl) and then a swift move of their businesses and expertise to the Jewish State... For that reason Palestine is a better destination, because it is the Holy Land and they will be excited and enthused (religious jews) to sacrifice money and security for it...He did underestimate the power of that Religious sector which eventually transformed Zionism into a concept inseparable from religion(s).

[FriendOfZeus]

But FoZ that is what happened....El-Meghwar gave his opinion in Jews and Xcoder gave his opinion in El-Meghwar for holding such opinions...perfectly clean play

I think El-Meghwar's problem was that he didn't explain why he thinks Jews are "evils" and "liars", a fact that makes his post incomplete and leaves us curious to know the rest

Yes of course, he can give out his opinion and speak his mind whenever he wants and i dont have any say in this issue, i just prefer it when people try to prove something without insulting the person they are speaking to, shows a bit more maturity.