Bashir Gemayel: Patriotic or Traitor ?!

[getryne]

Originally Posted by Patriotic

Who told you that he didn't have the power??? All the power of the Lebanese Forces and the support that Bachir got, was nothing for you????
As for the justice, well i think that i might agree with you, although that im pretty sure that you wrote this just to wrote and you do not have any prove against the justice of Bachir.
We might all love him or hate him ... this is not our main idea, the main idea that we cannot say that he was not so smart and so powerful.

well concerning the 1st pt., so u found out that bachir was powerful at that time. well yes he was powerful in achrafieh, the same as u say well samir ja3ja3 has the power, cze he's powerful in bcharre' , or junblat in jabal !!! wat i mean is that real power to control a country... well maybe bachar l2asad got that power, the control of a whole country with all armed forces nd intelligence agents,ministeries, nd parliament...(bt bachar l 2asad got nothing of that justice, thats y he's mish mtawwal) , well did bachir had the same power in 1982??! unless u consider the israeli army as bachir's militia, nd power of leading!!! nd the next main pt. was justice... maybe he applied justice in his militia soceity, maybe not... anyways i cant find how assassinating toni franjiyyi was a justice 4 bachir, or rejecting the syrian army while accepting the israeli's instead in beirut.... even the way he reached presidency is a great JUSTICE we'll always remember, maybe it's a military justice!! an invading israeli army controlls beirut, suddenly... the whole lebanese republic votes 4 bachir as a president!! somewat hard 2 beleive...... sometimes i think that the theory of "AL 7AKEM AL 3ADEL" is a good one to apply, bt sorry bachir was never a "7akem" nor a "3adel" ....
well, i've always heard that word some people always say: kil l7a2 3l philistiniyyi.... well no no, kil l7a2 3l souriyyin, no no LF(or kata2ib or l yamin) ballasho l7arb.... hinni l kharabo libnen.... ok, lesh min aymata fi shi ismo libnen?!, that lebanese government's just a new word in our history, we never had a "dawle' " , and 4 sure if the Fida2i was doin a great job out there in the south in killin some israelis, then he would find out that beirut is a better place to live in with no authorities there, same 4 syrians, same 4 LF,same 4 american or french embassador, thats our main problem, if we never had a "dawle' " , how would u expect others to treat us like a dawle'? .... well bachir was just tryin 2 fight his enemies by the others, if in 1978 palestinians r the enemies, then its ok 2 get the syrians down here to fight them... nd if in 1982 syrians r the enemies, then its ok to get the israeli army down here to fight the syrians.... he was just leading a gang called LF, that needs to ally with other gangs(syrians or israelis) to fight the other gangs....thats our civil war... nd everything abt lmabede2 wl woujoud l masi7i, wl qadiyyi l philistiniyyi, w mo7arabit l emperyaliyyi is just common **** . the only martyrs of the last civil war r the resistance ones, martyrs of Jabhat al mouqawama al wataniyya al lubnaniyya, nd martyrs of the lebanese army in GMA' war.... these r the only 2 battles of this war, nd the others r just(tinzikir wma tin3ad)

[getryne]

إيهود يعاري - صحافي إسرائيلي

أقولها بشكل جازم وبمنتهى الصراحة زحلة كانت فخاً نصبه بشير الجميل لحث (بيجين) على التحرك. شعر بشير وآخرون أن بيجين لم ترق له فكرة عملية عسكرية كبرى في لبنان ترمي إلى تنصيب بشير رئيساً، أو لإخراج السوريين أو لأي شيء وآخر، ولذا نصب الفخ. ليس لدي أدنى شكٍ اليوم في هذا الأمر، نصب الفخ لحمل الإسرائيليين على التدخل

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إيهود يعاري - صحافي إسرايلي

ماذا فعل بشير في المراحل الأولى لاتصالاته رفيعة المستوى مع الإسرائيليين؟ لقد أبدى شغفاً بتاريخ إسرائيل، كان يقول للناس كم تعلَّم من الحركة اليهودية السرية خلال فترة الانتداب البريطاني، وكيف يريد أن يقلد ذلك النموذج.. نموذج (الهاجانا) ووحدة (البالما) التي نشأ منها الجيش الإسرائيلي قبل قيام دولة إسرائيل. بشير كان صريحاً، وكان كذلك رجلاً متحمساً، وكان أيضاً يتسم بالرجولة، الإسرائيليون الذين شاؤوا أن يعجبوا به أعجبوا به، لم يكن كثيرون على علم بالاتصالات التي كانت جارية معه، ولكن عدداً كبيراً ممن كانوا يعرفون بذلك الأمر وصلوا إلى درجة اعتقدوه فيها واحداً منا

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بسام أبو شريف

الكتائب.. القوات اللبنانية ارتكبت مجازر بالأحرار.. مجازر الصفرة، مالحقوهم واحد واحد يطخوهم، وهذا أسلوب استخدمه بن جوريون لتوحيد العصابات الصهاينة، الشتيرن والأريجون وإلى آخره من شان يعمل منها جيش واحد، بشير الجميل استخدم العنف ضد جماعته من شان يوحد هذه القوات اللبنانية ووحد هذه القوات اللبنانية

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ميشال سماحة - الكتائب اللبنانية

ساءت علاقة بشير الجميل بسوريا، وبدأت الإساءة.. سوء العلاقة بين بشير وسوريا في منتصف تشرين الأول 76، وأعتقد أن ذلك جاء نتيجة خطأ تاريخي من بعض أعضاء القيادة الكتائبية. بدأ ينتج عن ذلك توسيع خط العلاقة والتعاون بين جزء أساسي من الفريق المسيحي -مثَّله بشير الجميل وداني شمعون وهذه التركيبة- مع إسرائيل على حساب إعادة صياغة العلاقات المسيحية الإسلامية في لبنان، واللبنانية مع سوريا

جورج حاوي

هنا الخطأ التاريخي لليمين اللبناني، الخطأ المدمر الذي لا يتكرر ولا يصحح، أقول لك بمسؤولية: انتهى يعني انتهت سيطرة اليمين اللبناني بالمفهوم الطائفي، جاء يمين جديد أعتى بمفهوم طائفي جديد، بس ذلك اليمين اللبناني انتهى دون رجعة في ذلك الوقت، حيث من وراء ظهر سوريا، وعلى دماء الحركة الوطنية والمقاومة، وجثة كمال جنبلاط، نكر الجميل ومد يده إلى إسرائيل

[AhmadElHusseini]

Traitor... because he simply collaborated w/ Israelis... and it is against Lebanese law... I don't see the great figure in him... and I'm surprised that many forget that he committed treason...

[AhmadElHusseini]

Originally Posted by lebanese_a

That's coming from a guy that thinks his country is a mistake!!! so tell me who defended Lebanon Nasser or 3arafat???

Nasrallah... and Moussawi before him... and Iranian Revolutionary Guards before Hezbollah...

[J()e]

Nasrallah... and Moussawi before him... and Iranian Revolutionary Guards before Hezbollah...

no comment!! .

[flamenguita]

I am sorry to tell all the ones who are attacking " Bachir... the Dream" are really targetting the 10452 km2 conception that our late leader Sheikh Bachir build.

He never kept his alliances under the table, never crawled in front of them, never begged. Although he in times made mistakes (like all other did), he realised at the end that there is only one country who will hold him and his principles, not Isreal, not Syria but the 10452 km2 Lebanon!

Isreal and Syria killed Bachir becoz they knew that he would have been the savior and the commander to the shore of prosperity and peace.

He payed his life to break his old alliances which he considered as deadly mistakes. he payed the life of his daughter. He was the shattered dream!

[SysTaMatIcS]

Originally Posted by flamenguita

I am sorry to tell all the ones who are attacking " Bachir... the Dream" are really targetting the 10452 km2 conception that our late leader Sheikh Bachir build.

He never kept his alliances under the table, never crawled in front of them, never begged. Although he in times made mistakes (like all other did), he realised at the end that there is only one country who will hold him and his principles, not Isreal, not Syria but the 10452 km2 Lebanon!

Isreal and Syria killed Bachir becoz they knew that he would have been the savior and the commander to the shore of prosperity and peace.

He payed his life to break his old alliances which he considered as deadly mistakes. he payed the life of his daughter. He was the shattered dream!

so gaegae did the same mistakes , wat does it differ from him??
if doing massacres is a mistake , then gaegae is a good person as bachir is , dont u think??
so wats to be liked in him , lets say he had a good side , and a bad side , dont we all?? dont gaegae have a good side and a bad side?? so y to DIVINE him , while bloods of 1000s is at his neck?? he a normal person like the rest , like gaegae , like birri , like jumblat who participated in a brutal way in the civil war , allyed with the israelians , and NO one tell me , that hes no responsible for wat happend in zgharta! , even the THOUGHT of getting rid of franjieh family is completely savage!

[flamenguita]

Originally Posted by systamatics

so gaegae did the same mistakes , wat does it differ from him??
if doing massacres is a mistake , then gaegae is a good person as bachir is , dont u think??
so wats to be liked in him , lets say he had a good side , and a bad side , dont we all?? dont gaegae have a good side and a bad side?? so y to DIVINE him , while bloods of 1000s is at his neck?? he a normal person like the rest , like gaegae , like birri , like jumblat who participated in a brutal way in the civil war , allyed with the israelians , and NO one tell me , that hes no responsible for wat happend in zgharta! , even the THOUGHT of getting rid of franjieh family is completely savage!

Systa, Bachir is NOT responsible of the massacre of Ehden ( refer to the marada site to make sure). It was a deadly mission for Geagea who was Entirely responsible.

Bachir made mistakes yes, but as i said he realised at the end that only the great leader makes great history, but the SSNP and Chartouny didn't leave him the chance to translate this! They murdered him! And i bet the isreilis has smthg to do with it coz bachir quickly cut it short with them!

Geagea was, still a criminal and didn't change his attitude and plz don't compare btw them!

[ORANGE BERET]

El-Bash si a true dream for the majority of the Christians who were the only ones to defend Lebanon against Palestinian and the Syrians. What the iraniens did about that, nothing of all they were one of the shares which benefit from the war of Lebanon for their clean profits. Bash saved Lebanon against the palestinian case.(consequences)
he learned us to save the country 10452Km.
when the others learned to save Palestine & Kods for religion reasons, wel Ommé el arabiyyé.
we are Patriots not phanatics. Stop accusing him, he is a sign...
The Iraniens, Syrians, americans, israelians, saudi.., ... are all in the same side against Lebanon.

[SysTaMatIcS]

israel to him wasnt an enemy who was invading lebanon , he dealed with them , while he fought the syrians with brutality , izdawagiyi!